joelsmith
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There no winners in war, only survivors.
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Jul 5, 2012 22:33:58 GMT -5
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 5, 2017 18:10:05 GMT -5
Gary, the "chains" were debated over on TL with no consensus. One modeler waved the BS flag, while another one stated that with the spade fully emplaced there was nothing to support the loading platform, so something had to be used to hold up the platform. As to "Adolf's Revenge", is it possible that you have confused a photo of the M12 SPG that was based on the M3/M4 chassis? The aiming stakes question? I don't know what to think. I have the Tankograd book on the M12, M40, M43 SPG's and there is no mention of aiming stakes in the photos. Honestly, I don't remember seeing them in any of the "in action" photos I have in my references. So, about the gunless M40 ammo carriers, according to the Tankograd book, one prototype was built, but not approved for production. Are you mistaking the T30 cargo carrier that was a modified M12 SPG? I look forward to continuing this discussion with you, Joel.
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sturmbird
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Jun 21, 2012 13:51:45 GMT -5
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Post by sturmbird on Jan 5, 2017 23:39:13 GMT -5
Gary, the "chains" were debated over on TL with no consensus. One modeler waved the BS flag, while another one stated that with the spade fully emplaced there was nothing to support the loading platform, so something had to be used to hold up the platform. As to "Adolf's Revenge", is it possible that you have confused a photo of the M12 SPG that was based on the M3/M4 chassis? The aiming stakes question? I don't know what to think. I have the Tankograd book on the M12, M40, M43 SPG's and there is no mention of aiming stakes in the photos. Honestly, I don't remember seeing them in any of the "in action" photos I have in my references. So, about the gunless M40 ammo carriers, according to the Tankograd book, one prototype was built, but not approved for production. Are you mistaking the T30 cargo carrier that was a modified M12 SPG? I look forward to continuing this discussion with you, Joel. * think I worded it wrong with the chains. What I meant was that in place of the two chains, they used two cables. I saw no chains being used. * Adolf's Revenge in the photos was for sure an M40. It's for sure a very early M40, and probably a preproduction chassis. Now I'm going to start looking for the sister chassis that was shipped with an 8" howitzer barrel. * You can only shoot at targets that you can see thru the barrel, unless you have aiming stakes. If your in a hurry you'll probably be dead. Add to this, the fact that you can't register the gun without them. No arty battalion would allow you to shoot with a sane mind. Now you can put the stakes out in front of you, and behind you. But you gotta have them. They usually set them up 150 feet to as much as 200 feet from the gunners scope. Elevation (quadrant) in WWII and Korea was usually set wit a protractor/level device placed atop the breech. Be sure to leave the top of the breech unpainted. Not sure then the level was added to the gun sight, but suspect it was post Korea. * The cargo carrier looked like an M40 hull, but will go back for a relook. I remember more than one. * found another issue yesterday. I thought the powder charges looked odd, but having never seen WWII powder bags I let it go. Tamiya may have copied somebody's, but they are not U.S. issue. I saw Korean era powder in use, and they are similar to Vietnam (white bag). There will be a 5,6,& 7 in the bundle with the first bag having a red disc on the end. They also used a green bag powder that went from one to five. Green bag is smaller in diameter, and come two to a canister. Can't vouch for the canister in the kit, as I've never seen Korean issue powder tubes. The rounds just don't look like WWII, Korean, or Vietnam issue stuff, but maybe correct for an M198. The pallets are wrong. Tops are OK, but the base is not right. Look at Wild Bill's M114 build for the correct style. The brass driving ring looks too wide (should be about 1.38") and I never saw the red part. The did add a white ring in the late 60's. hope this helps gary
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 6, 2017 8:01:43 GMT -5
Gary, to the best of my knowledge,(based on my limited reading) is that all M40/M43 vehicles had M4A3E8 Horizontal Volute Spring Suspension. the M12 was built with Vertical Volute Spring Suspension, originally with M3 Lee type bogies that had the return roller on the top center of the bogie frame. Rebuilt M12 vehicles used the "upswept" return roller mount as originally used on M4 Shermans. If you could, please post your photos or let us know the publications that they are in. I am not the "be all/end all" of armor knowledge, and, if proved wrong I certainally will admit my errors, talk more soon, Joel.
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moramarth
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Post by moramarth on Jan 6, 2017 10:19:24 GMT -5
I'm trying to break the habit of posting without checking, but I'm pushed for time so here goes. I have a hazy recall the suspension changes had something to do with being able to accommodate later types of tracks, for availability/commonality reasons. From scrapyard photos of M3 Grants retained in post-war Australian service, they seem to have had a similar upgrade.
Regards,
M
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 6, 2017 11:56:38 GMT -5
Moramarth, perhaps I should have not used the word originally. The D37892 suspension was used om the M3 Lee/Grant series. This was the bogie unit with the return roller on the top of the bogie mount. This bogie was also used on early Shermans. This was replaced by the D47527 suspension bogie with the "skid" on the top center of the bogie mount, and, the return roller mounted on the "rear" of the bogie mount. There were 3 different "skid" designs used, and 2 different return roller arms. One of the arms was the "straight" version with the standard return roller mount, and, also used with a "pillow block" spacer to raise the return roller. The upswept return roller mount dispensed with the need to use the pillow block spacer. As a aside the return roller mount could be mounted on either side of the main bogie casting. This was to streamline production and reduce the required amount of spares. This is the reason you drill 4 holes in the bogie mount opposite of the return roller. HTH, Joel.
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sturmbird
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Jun 21, 2012 13:51:45 GMT -5
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Post by sturmbird on Jan 6, 2017 15:49:17 GMT -5
Gary, to the best of my knowledge,(based on my limited reading) is that all M40/M43 vehicles had M4A3E8 Horizontal Volute Spring Suspension. the M12 was built with Vertical Volute Spring Suspension, originally with M3 Lee type bogies that had the return roller on the top center of the bogie frame. Rebuilt M12 vehicles used the "upswept" return roller mount as originally used on M4 Shermans. If you could, please post your photos or let us know the publications that they are in. I am not the "be all/end all" of armor knowledge, and, if proved wrong I certainally will admit my errors, talk more soon, Joel. had another long look last night, and couldn't find that one picture (actually the only one I've ever seen)of "Adolfs Revenge." I did find "Adolfs Assassin", and it looked to be an M12 GMC. I did find two interesting things about the first two in Europe. They were not really M40's, as the design had not been finalized yet. IOW still a "T Series." Also found out that many gun crews didn't use the cable or chains with the ramp. Still have not found a single M40 using two chains. I also found two more of the gunless versions. Both were somewhat different. They are fairly easy to spot by the rivets alone. Now here's something even more interesting! The T43 track of course started life with an 8" howitzer barrel. But was later changed to use the 155mm long tom barrel (carriage is the same except for the recuperators and recoil system). Then later the 155mm howitzer gun mount was installed trying to find a way to make the two 155mm guns as accurate as the 8". gary
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sturmbird
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Post by sturmbird on Jan 8, 2017 21:26:12 GMT -5
Dropped by the local LHS awhile ago to see what happened to a couple He111's I'd ordered. The had the M40 and the metal barrel kits. $79 and $27!! This kit is ripe for Asuka to do and get the hull done right. (Tamiya hull is too narrow), and still come in under $75. gary
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joelsmith
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There no winners in war, only survivors.
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 8, 2017 21:38:04 GMT -5
Check Tower Hobbies. They were having a special offer on Tamiya kits of free shipping.
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 11, 2017 21:39:31 GMT -5
In progress photo
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 16, 2017 15:57:07 GMT -5
More progress
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 16, 2017 15:59:59 GMT -5
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deafpanzer
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Jun 3, 2012 11:41:34 GMT -5
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Post by deafpanzer on Jan 17, 2017 12:28:25 GMT -5
Looking good!
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 17, 2017 14:07:00 GMT -5
DP, thank you for the complement.
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Post by Leon on Jan 17, 2017 14:11:59 GMT -5
Nice progress Joel!
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joelsmith
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There no winners in war, only survivors.
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 17, 2017 15:23:50 GMT -5
Thank You Leon, I am delayed waiting for paint. Next update maybe Thursday.
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Post by tonylee on Jan 17, 2017 17:50:51 GMT -5
Try a Light Gray as a back drop color Joel.
Tony lee
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joelsmith
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Post by joelsmith on Jan 17, 2017 20:44:37 GMT -5
Thanks for the advice Tony! I'll ask my Wife to pick out the gray back drop. I would do it myself but I am color blind. Don't worry, I'm not offended, I've been color blind all my life. Talk more soon, Joel.
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Post by tonylee on Jan 17, 2017 21:08:22 GMT -5
Be sure to get "Light Grey".
Tony lee
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