tinting primer

[sturmbird]

has anybody here ever tried to tint primer (say adding a drop or two of green to light grey) to aid in a complete cover coat of paint? Might try it, to see what happens.
gary

[TRM]

You should be able to tint any primer. The only difference between pant and primer is the binders. Stick within the range (Branding) that you are using and you should be fine!

[John Everett]

Todd's right. So long as the paint and primer are compatible you can make the primer any color you like.

My favorite combination is Mister Surfacer 1500 - thinned with Mister Leveling Thinner - and Tamiya paint added for color.

[Tojo72]

For sure,vallejo has a whole line of colored primers

[sturmbird]

I was painting some flat pieces of plastic stock the otherday, and my son ask me what I was doing. Said I was looking for a better yellow cover than what I'd been getting. I tried painting over light grey primer and even white primer. Plus the usual primer colors. None were what I'd call great, and under an Ott light you could see the unevenness. Josh said my error was not with the paint, but with the primer (Josh owns a painting company). He said to try the white or light grey with a tiny bit of yellow in it. Have not tried it yet, but will pretty soon. Then he told me my paint mix and setup was completely wrong! (he's never used an air brush in his life) Pointed out that the finish was from some of the paint drying in the air before contact with the surface.
gary

[TRM]

Yellow s one of those wildcards, but typically a lighter primer should do the trick. There can be an issue with the paint drying before it hits the surface too. Air pressure, distance from the surface and of course ratio of thinner to paint plays a part. There is a balance in there. The lower the pressure, the closer to the surface you can get with more control and less drying before it hits the surface. To shoot lower, thinning might be required depending on the paint. What brand paint are you using, what pressure are you shooting at and how far away do you typically shoot from the surface?

[sturmbird]

Nov 28, 2017 15:11:54 GMT -5 TRM said:

Yellow s one of those wildcards, but typically a lighter primer should do the trick. There can be an issue with the paint drying before it hits the surface too. Air pressure, distance from the surface and of course ratio of thinner to paint plays a part. There is a balance in there. The lower the pressure, the closer to the surface you can get with more control and less drying before it hits the surface. To shoot lower, thinning might be required depending on the paint. What brand paint are you using, what pressure are you shooting at and how far away do you typically shoot from the surface?

mostly Model Master, but have also used Tamiya and Humbrol. Looked a couple others that are said to be ready for an airbrush, but they were out of yellow. Plus they don't use the same color coding that everybody else uses. Found a bottle of retarder, and may give it a try.
gary

[TRM]

All color coding aside, I would think that you would not have too much drying prior to the pint hitting the surface with any of the enamels. Tamiya, albeit a solvent, still preforms much like an acrylic and can dry on its way to the surface. I would look at distance and pressure. I shoot primarily water based acrylics. Pressure range is around 15psi and I stay about 4 inches from the surface. I always thin even when the paint is airbrush ready...typically 1 drop of thinner to 3 or 4 drop of paint. I rarely see drying before the surface. If I want to get closer, I turn the pressure down to 8 or 10 psi. Any lower, I need to thin more.

What psi are you shooting the MM Paints and are you more than 6 inches from the surface?

[sturmbird]

Nov 29, 2017 8:37:02 GMT -5 TRM said:

All color coding aside, I would think that you would not have too much drying prior to the pint hitting the surface with any of the enamels. Tamiya, albeit a solvent, still preforms much like an acrylic and can dry on its way to the surface. I would look at distance and pressure. I shoot primarily water based acrylics. Pressure range is around 15psi and I stay about 4 inches from the surface. I always thin even when the paint is airbrush ready...typically 1 drop of thinner to 3 or 4 drop of paint. I rarely see drying before the surface. If I want to get closer, I turn the pressure down to 8 or 10 psi. Any lower, I need to thin more.

What psi are you shooting the MM Paints and are you more than 6 inches from the surface?

I never pay much attention to pressure, but like shooting at lower pressures. My air pump is really pooped out at 20psi (Iwata Smart Jet). My main interest is air flow. The gauges on ALL pumps are not very accurate at minus 15psi pressures. Probably off as much as 20%. They do make gauges that come in at 2% accuracy, but they also cost about $400!! I shoot anywhere from four to seven inches with my Iwata air brush. I have a couple of older Pasche brushes that with the right needle I can shoot from about ten inches. My air pump won't handle this, but the old one would.

My issues are with very light colors mostly, and getting a good cover without doing eight coats. I do run my paint fairly thin. I may opt for a pump with a little more CFM at the same pressures, as this is becoming an issue. The nice thing about the smart jet is the way it works at very low pressures, but not so hot at higher pressures. My main issue right now is not to spend any more money of an air pump or air brush (I will buy a new pistol grip brush), but to buy a nice spray booth (can you hear me Bob Pace??).
gary

[TRM]

Gotcha brotha! This s one of those areas in the hobby that either works spectacular or there is a constant give and take. With respect to calibration of standard gauges, within reason, more are close enough for what we are doing and minor adjustments can be made both at the regulator (if there is one) or the airbrush itself...depending on what brushes are being used.

With that said, light colors are much harder to get full coverage unless you are dealing with "some" enamels and of course lacquers. I know with my use of water based acrylics, red, yellow and white basically suck to get a full coverage spray out of the gate. If I can, I run a lighter primer which can help. Other than that, I lay down a few coats to get my desired coverage. Tricky issue with enamels in doing multiple coats is the demarcation line that shows up. More folks I know get tweaked over the bump from building up coats. With the acrylics, I don't personally see this happening at all unless I wield my AB like I am unleashing the Kraken! LOL

I have a smartjet as a backup actually. It is a pretty nice compressor if you ask me. I did add a cheap $4 regulator inline before their non-adjustable and their constant 30 to 50psi inline. Worked like a charm! Typically I run...and don't laugh, one of those cheap-ass Harbor Freight jobs. I have bought 2 in the past 8 years. One, I thought, crapped out and with all the show demos and seminars I do, I need something I can rely on and replace easily if needed. At shows I have run it up to about 40 hours over 4 days...then I beat the crap out of it at home...both are still running like a charm. The only issue I ran into was the gasket on the piston box is cardboard and the fibers from the cardboard got embedded in the piton ring causing a huge lag...took it apart, cleaned it with denatured alcohol and bingo, like brand new!

Distance might be the biggest factor...I think. I try and stay between 4 and 6 inches form the surface...everyone is different. But what I found, the paint does not dry before it hits the surface in this range. Anything further out, I run the chance of pebbling. I also regulate my pressure at the trigger. I am running a few brushes, but my H&S brushes have and amazing trigger setup allowing me to bring the psi down at the trigger at will. I checked all of this with an anemometer and other than maybe my latest Badger, the H&S smoothly regulates the air at the trigger.

Are you using any sort of "Mac Valve" inline? I ask because the "CFM" comment. I know some folks like the valves...personally I don't see the need for them. I can raise the velocity by raising the psi at the regulator and controlling it with the trigger and not using the valve to squeeze the flow off to raise the velocity. Just trying to think of different angles to what might be happening on your end.

[sturmbird]

Dec 1, 2017 16:39:13 GMT -5 TRM said:

Gotcha brotha! This s one of those areas in the hobby that either works spectacular or there is a constant give and take. With respect to calibration of standard gauges, within reason, more are close enough for what we are doing and minor adjustments can be made both at the regulator (if there is one) or the airbrush itself...depending on what brushes are being used.

With that said, light colors are much harder to get full coverage unless you are dealing with "some" enamels and of course lacquers. I know with my use of water based acrylics, red, yellow and white basically suck to get a full coverage spray out of the gate. If I can, I run a lighter primer which can help. Other than that, I lay down a few coats to get my desired coverage. Tricky issue with enamels in doing multiple coats is the demarcation line that shows up. More folks I know get tweaked over the bump from building up coats. With the acrylics, I don't personally see this happening at all unless I wield my AB like I am unleashing the Kraken! LOL

I have a smartjet as a backup actually. It is a pretty nice compressor if you ask me. I did add a cheap $4 regulator inline before their non-adjustable and their constant 30 to 50psi inline. Worked like a charm! Typically I run...and don't laugh, one of those cheap-a$$ Harbor Freight jobs. I have bought 2 in the past 8 years. One, I thought, crapped out and with all the show demos and seminars I do, I need something I can rely on and replace easily if needed. At shows I have run it up to about 40 hours over 4 days...then I beat the crap out of it at home...both are still running like a charm. The only issue I ran into was the gasket on the piston box is cardboard and the fibers from the cardboard got embedded in the piton ring causing a huge lag...took it apart, cleaned it with denatured alcohol and bingo, like brand new!

Distance might be the biggest factor...I think. I try and stay between 4 and 6 inches form the surface...everyone is different. But what I found, the paint does not dry before it hits the surface in this range. Anything further out, I run the chance of pebbling. I also regulate my pressure at the trigger. I am running a few brushes, but my H&S brushes have and amazing trigger setup allowing me to bring the psi down at the trigger at will. I checked all of this with an anemometer and other than maybe my latest Badger, the H&S smoothly regulates the air at the trigger.

Are you using any sort of "Mac Valve" inline? I ask because the "CFM" comment. I know some folks like the valves...personally I don't see the need for them. I can raise the velocity by raising the psi at the regulator and controlling it with the trigger and not using the valve to squeeze the flow off to raise the velocity. Just trying to think of different angles to what might be happening on your end.

at one time I had two or three of those high end regulators that were left over parts from a machine build. Also had a small air dryer that is to die for (Hansen). Ontop of that I had a box of good used ones. I remember building a series of 5 psi dry air systems for a series of machines I built. Somehow the regulators were double ordered, and never put them back in stock as I planned on building three or four more systems with them. I got busted out right before Christmas in 94, and never went back to the swamp again. Was out for five and a half years, and really didn't want to back there again. They probably got tossed in the dumpster to keep from paying taxes on them! Now you know why military stuff is so expensive.

For most folks, a Wilkerson regulator, filter, and coalescent filter are top of the line. The three units all snap together with an O ring between them. Work a hundred times better than most filter/regulators supplied with compressors. Plus you can buy just about any part to rebuild one.
gary