More Proof — Monogram was Right!

[cbaltrin]

Now I just need a better paint option than Testors flat red!

[tcoat]

[stikpusher]

Monogram was pretty good on their molding and markings research. Their stuff was cutting edge for that department at the time.

[cbaltrin]

If only I had the internet in 1988…

[tcoat]

A little more digging shows that they were right but wrong at the same time. The ONLY pictures with red tanks were the Skyraiders of VA-196 on the Bonhomme Richard in 1964. The markings for the Intrepid in the Monogram kits do not show red tanks anywhere. Even the Bon Homme Richard aircraft show different in other years so likely the red tanks were that one mission in '64 and not the norm. A classic case of modeling specific aircraft in a tight timeline. 

BHR 1962



BHR 1964



BHR 1966



The Monogram kit markings for the intrepid. Not red



The Air Force camo is not red either

[406 Silverado]

Aug 27, 2024 8:18:35 GMT -5 stikpusher said:

Monogram was pretty good on their molding and markings research. Their stuff was cutting edge for that department at the time.

  When I was a kid I couldn't get over the rivet detail which I thought was pretty dang good and although they took a lot of flak over it for years.....they were right on that too.

[cbaltrin]

my understanding was  that the red tanks were napalm, and the other tanks were fuel — not quite sure, but did red shirts load fuel tanks?  I see the red tanks are indeed being loaded by ordnance personnel. Also, your photo show many different types and sizes of tanks being used as external fuel tanks.

[tcoat]

Aug 27, 2024 9:07:59 GMT -5 cbaltrin said:

my understanding was always that the red tanks were napalm, and the other tanks were fuel. — not quite sure, but did red shirts load fuel tanks?  I see the red tanks are indeed being loaded by ordinance personnel.

Napalm tanks don't have fins. They are designed to tumble to fling it around. They do have a red band though. Even if they were red there is no photo evidence I can find that shows they were used more than that one short period on the BHR. Not one picture of them anywhere else.

[tcoat]

Here are the drop tanks. They are specific to Douglas but that isn't what they are loading either.

tailspintopics.blogspot.com/2011/07/douglas-low-drag-external-fuel-tanks.html

I am now going with the Mk84 bomb. Possibly red to indicate white phosphorous? May just conventional but not painted that is why they only show up once?

[Steve Zuleski]

That's a 2 thousand pound pig! And when we loaded them on those 16's you could see and hear the bird groan! That bomb load truck didn't like either.

[Steve Zuleski]

Aug 27, 2024 9:07:59 GMT -5 cbaltrin said:

my understanding was  that the red tanks were napalm, and the other tanks were fuel — not quite sure, but did red shirts load fuel tanks?  I see the red tanks are indeed being loaded by ordnance personnel. Also, your photo show many different types and sizes of tanks being used as external fuel tanks.

When I was in it was our responsibility to load the ext fuel tanks, USAF, but not sure about Navy, they multi-tasked a lot.

I was always impressed at the weight these birds could handle; wings folded.

[tcoat]

Aug 27, 2024 13:36:38 GMT -5 Steve Zuleski said:

That's a 2 thousand pound pig! And when we loaded them on those 16's you could see and hear the bird groan! That bomb load truck didn't like either.

This guy is very impressive then!




I knew somebody would come along that actually handled these things.

[cbaltrin]

I think he is referring to the MK84 photo with the F-16. This is not a Mark 84 – it’s just shaped like one.

I found what I was looking for. Seems they were indeed napalm/fire bombs.. 1000 lb apparently…
as for napalm bombs not having fins, that is probably generally true , however in a war that lasted a decade and saw continuous evolution and improvement in weapons and weapons platforms, I wouldn’t put my money on blanket statements. I would guess the usage of this particular version of this particular weapon was short-lived, as I have never seen them on any other aircraft other than Skyraiders.

[tcoat]

EXCELLENT that's them! I spent all morning looking for a picture like that. These are the white phosphorus bombs I spoke of before. Although they do contain napalm they are not actually napalm cylinders/bombs. Whole different mission parameters. Napalm is used to clear large areas of cover (and any poor soul in that area) with a large a radius as possible. These fire bombs are intended to do precision strikes (by 1960's standards) to penetrate hard points.