Leopard 2 in the British Army?

[Deleted]

Hi Guys,

I'm planning a what if build, instead of Challenger 2 what if we had gone the Leopard 2 route? What would a British Leopard 2 look like? 

At the moment I have a Tamiya Leopard 2A5 as a base, an Eduard Bar Armour set, and a Voyager and orange hobby etch set in the stash. My thoughts are to change MG to standard GPMG on ring mount, maybe add belly armour and upgrade the gun to a L55, as one was fitted and tested on a Challenger 2 in 2006 I believe, when the future ammunition requirement problem was looked at. I am also thinking of adding the IED detectors, a front camera and Ariel platform, as per TES upgrade, and belly armour from the A6M upgrade would also make sense.

At the moment I'm not sure on what smoke discharges to use, and side skirts, whether Cobham or as currently fitted. In theory the weights right, with a Challenger 2 In at 62.5 tons and Leopard 2 62.3 tons, so the upgrades are feasible. There's also the Enforcer to think about as well?

so guys I would be happy to here your thoughts and ideas. What should go in and what out? ......... I know a BV's an essential!! But you won't see it!

cheers

Gary

[Smudge]

Hi Gary

Sounds like a great idea I'll be watching this one.

I reckon the big British fire extinguishers on the outside and extra fuel drums seeing as its a 'what if'. Maybe some black plastic water cans and British stowage. British aerial bases?

A BV? What about a 18ltr Norwegian of tea LOL

Smudge
The other one

[paulh]

I love it!
I'm in -front row -and I brought my own popcorn!
P

[bullardino]

Interesting what if...

[Deleted]

interesting idea, I think all the changes suggested would be sensible, as for the smoke dischargers I would say chally 2 ones would suit

[paulh]

Hope you're hands are clean

[Deleted]

Hi Guys,

Thanks to all for the input ....... half expected to see a lynching party!

Smudge - Yep somehow overlooked that detail, so extinguisher's going on front track guards or IED bracket. Various Stowage and Plastic cans will be added. Need to check a few references to see how in field the Camo. Net stowage baskets are used.
Only 18 Ltrs ....... must be the Defence cuts.

Paulh - you may need quite a bit at the speed I build!

Snipersmudge - As the DARstellung-Kanonen-AbSchuss mounts on front additional armour, I'm leaning towards placing Challenger Smoke dischargers on there.

Dicky - jury's still out on the gun. The 120mm smoothbore is now almost the NATO standard gun. You can argue that for compatibility of ammunition and parts the L/55 makes more sense. I think now only the UK and India use the 120mm rifled gun, and we have stopped making ammunition for it! Even Jordan have re-gunned there Challengers to smooth bore. The deciders are the separate logistics required for UK ammunition, The use or not of HESH rounds, combined with the L55 being able to use scaled ammo and the L30 cannot, which means the penetrator used in the sabot round of scaled ammo can be made longer.

The L55 Challenger 2 installation would have retained the L30 rifled gun's cradle, gun clamp, thermal sleeve, fume extractor and muzzle reference system. For those interested A picture of the smoothbore Challenger can be found here; img102.imageshack.us/img102/5966/cr2sbrws1ev.jpg

The biggest issue would have been the storage of one piece ammo in a Challenger.

Cheers

Gary

[TRM]

Sounds like a great project there Gary!! Have at it!

[Deleted]

Following some great feedback, it looks like the final idea is coming together. To date the plan is on a base of a Leopard 2a5, up-armour Front and underside. Add scratch built armoured side skirts at front part of chassis and the turret side Bar armour the rest. Scratch build front turret armour to reduce shot trap and incorporate Challenger Smoke Dischargers. Add a front camera and under armour APU. Scratch build An Enforcer and add to turret and lose rail mounted GPMG. Add IED detectors and Ariel's. Re- gun to L55. Add some stowage.

So that's the plan. Don't want it to look to much like an SG, somewhere between an upgraded 2A4 and 2A7+ I think. British bolt on armour was never that pretty.

Now just awaiting for a few bits to be delivered and we can make a start.

Gary

[Deleted]

Last delivery today, so work can start after the Notts MAFVA show Saturday ........ I'm an old Guy, but I haven't got the hang of this multitasking and need to get some stuff done for the club stand first.

[Deleted]

Hi Gazzer,
we did look at the Leopard very closely before contracting BAE Systems to build the Challenger II

Dicky is right, we would have used the RO 120 rifled gun to keep logistics simple.

We also, in typical MoD fashion , looked at every conceivable option that improved performance and survivability. This also included some bespoke Cobham composite armour and the new 1500bhp diesel powerpack.
After all that it was cheaper to buy the Chally II 

Looking forward to seeing where you take your build 

[Deleted]

Thanks for the great insight Stevem. Its evolving nicely.