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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 8, 2023 8:41:50 GMT -5
Guys, I worked on the turret for last two nights and I really enjoyed it very much. So far I really like RFM as it is my first and I will not hesitate to buy kits from them. I was amazed by the surface texture on the turret especially the mantlet...  Oooooooooohhh that's nice! Not to mention speedy work! ATB Andrew Not sure if I am fast enough since I am well known to be a very slow builder. I have put more than 12 hours on the gun and turret already!  Thanks for looking mate! Should the flat rolled/pressed armor plate be textured like that? I’ve seen plenty of texture on cast armor, it’s a result of the process, but I dont ever recall such such texture on rolled/pressed armor plates. I wondered the same but I really like the texture. It is possible that they rushed with the production during the late war period to get those out of factory sooner? You should have seen the German helmets especially the differences between M36 and M42 helmets which I have and you will be surprised to see how rough the texture is on late war M42 helmet. After priming and painting jobs, we probably won't see much especially the camo result. Making good progress Andy! Turret looks really good. Thanks buddy! Should the flat rolled/pressed armor plate be textured like that? I’ve seen plenty of texture on cast armor, it’s a result of the process, but I dont ever recall such such texture on rolled/pressed armor plates. My method for rolled steel in express short below: Make small burrs with a dental bit, stipple on liquid surfacer with a bristle brush and sand smooth. For imitating scaling mask some spots irregularly with liquid mask before stippling. Sure, I tagged you on one of Steve Zuleski's thread recently so you can see his comment how to do this. You might have to buy him a drink too! Got it to work, but I must do it in "BBCode" mode. When switching back to preview you have it.  Thanks man! Love the result of your work. I have tried that on my Tiger and it worked out great! I used Mr Surfacer 500 which is the thickest of all. Glad you were able to make multi quotes! I definitely use both tabs 'Preview' and 'BBCode' to make sure everything looks OK before I post. I didn't have bench time last night... was too exhausted after mowing the lawn with that lousy air quality caused by wild fires in Canada. |
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Post by chromdome35 on Jun 8, 2023 9:13:25 GMT -5
That texturing looks great, this is really going to be a nice build.
Those weld seams are looking good.
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Post by dupes on Jun 8, 2023 15:42:33 GMT -5
I think you got some putty on your Panther? |
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Joe Rix
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Post by Joe Rix on Jun 8, 2023 18:22:38 GMT -5
Wow! Somehow I managed to be late to this party. And what a party it is. Incredible work so far Andy. That appears to be one awesome kit. I'm an armor novice so I can't really speak to the right or wrong of certain texturing. What I can say is the kit texturing is nice and your added texturing is excellent. All in all should create an outstanding effect.
I'm also curious as to how you put multiple quotes in one post.
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Post by tcoat on Jun 8, 2023 19:07:21 GMT -5
Should the flat rolled/pressed armor plate be textured like that? I’ve seen plenty of texture on cast armor, it’s a result of the process, but I dont ever recall such such texture on rolled/pressed armor plates. I wondered the same but I really like the texture. It is possible that they rushed with the production during the late war period to get those out of factory sooner? You should have seen the German helmets especially the differences between M36 and M42 helmets which I have and you will be surprised to see how rough the texture is on late war M42 helmet. After priming and painting jobs, we probably won't see much especially the camo result. The texture of the rolled armour is not from the rolling process but from the surface hardening. Rolling the plates was done to align the grain (yes steel has a grain) to make the steel more resilient and spread the stress of impact this gave it some flex to absorb the energy but left it "soft". To counter that they surface hardened with high intensity open flame oxy-acetylene torching and an oil quench. This gave a hard outer surface to deflect or shatter rounds and a softer inside that would flex to absorb the energy. The texture on the outside is a result of the steel spalling and deforming on the surface from the torched heat treat. This is why you only see it on certain German armour since this method was only used for a short time. |
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Post by 406 Silverado on Jun 8, 2023 21:14:01 GMT -5
Beautiful work and love how the welds & texture turned out Andy. LOTS of luvin' going into this one!!
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Post by 406 Silverado on Jun 8, 2023 21:15:00 GMT -5
I wondered the same but I really like the texture. It is possible that they rushed with the production during the late war period to get those out of factory sooner? You should have seen the German helmets especially the differences between M36 and M42 helmets which I have and you will be surprised to see how rough the texture is on late war M42 helmet. After priming and painting jobs, we probably won't see much especially the camo result. The texture of the rolled armour is not from the rolling process but from the surface hardening. Rolling the plates was done to align the grain (yes steel has a grain) to make the steel more resilient and spread the stress of impact this gave it some flex to absorb the energy but left it "soft". To counter that they surface hardened with high intensity open flame oxy-acetylene torching and an oil quench. This gave a hard outer surface to deflect or shatter rounds and a softer inside that would flex to absorb the energy. The texture on the outside is a result of the steel spalling and deforming on the surface from the torched heat treat. This is why you only see it on certain German armour since this method was only used for a short time. Interesting notes about the steel in regards to the different grades used and plate rolling. I never knew any of this stuff. |
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kaktus
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Post by kaktus on Jun 9, 2023 2:28:45 GMT -5
Nice kit and extras, following with interest. Rfm kits have a nice details, but sometimes fittings are a little poor and needs a little dry fitting and sanding.
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 13, 2023 7:47:38 GMT -5
Guys, I am sorry for being slow here as I had to head out of town for the weekend to attend a friend's memorial service and it was a very beautiful service. Thanks for sharing great information how the rolling steel process was done by the way as I learned something myself! I was able to work on my Panther and I still really like the kit however I ran into my first roadblock building the driver's periscope and the kit can be over engineered sometimes. I decided to skip it after the PE was glued stuck to my finger and I didn't have de-bonder handy!   While I was trying to repair the periscope clear part damaged by superglue, an accident happened... Future floor wax was spilled all over the instructions! Now it is all wrinkled...  More incidents occurred after the Future accident, I lost the PE piece for the rear intake and I looked for it for more than 15 minutes but no luck so I had to make one from scratch.  As soon as scratch built screen guard was installed, I found the missing PE sitting right in front of me and I just wanted to laugh!  The rear top section had more than 50 pieces and I am pleased with the details so far.  Now it is starting to look like a tank...  Thanks for looking! |
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Post by Tojo72 on Jun 13, 2023 8:07:37 GMT -5
Really coming together now
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armornutii
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Post by armornutii on Jun 13, 2023 8:30:14 GMT -5
Way to muscle thru DP, I probably woukd have bagged the day and waited until the moon and stars aligned again.
Never fails with the missing part....no more than surrender to the reality if life without it, move to the next step and POOF there it is, mocking you from right before your eyes, begging you to take it back and all will be rainbows and unicorns......LOL.
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stikpusher
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Post by stikpusher on Jun 13, 2023 11:35:58 GMT -5
Oh that is too much PE for my tastes. More power to ya for bashing on thru the speed bumps Andy.
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 13, 2023 12:10:58 GMT -5
Really coming together now Thanks Tojo!!! Way to muscle thru DP, I probably woukd have bagged the day and waited until the moon and stars aligned again. Never fails with the missing part....no more than surrender to the reality if life without it, move to the next step and POOF there it is, mocking you from right before your eyes, begging you to take it back and all will be rainbows and unicorns......LOL. LOLOLOL! That's what happened to me last night! I lost another piece while working on the tools rack and I gave up after five minutes of looking!  I figured my eyes are tired so hopefully I can find it tonight. Hope I get to see rainbows and unicorns again! Oh that is too much PE for my tastes. More power to ya for bashing on thru the speed bumps Andy. Thanks Joe! I am afraid that I am starting to loose my taste for PE stuff now. I always buy those huge PE upgrade sets for my model kits in the past but now I don't think I want to deal with too much PE work because I have so little patient now. I guess it comes with the age thing too? |
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Post by dupes on Jun 13, 2023 14:22:31 GMT -5
It always bugs me when there's no plastic option for every part. Sometimes you don't want to have to mess with absolutely miniscule PE bits!
The mold seam on the mantlet - it's so pronounced, it must HAVE to be there? I'm not near any of my Panther refs right now to check.
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armornutii
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Post by armornutii on Jun 13, 2023 15:01:33 GMT -5
There is a picture around here somewhere that show the line across the mantle bug as life.
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Medicman71
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Post by Medicman71 on Jun 13, 2023 15:11:47 GMT -5
Very nice! That gun looks great! I feel ya with the PE. I get it all the time and it'll irritate me to no end and yet I keep getting it. Lol.
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Post by dupes on Jun 13, 2023 17:47:47 GMT -5
There is a picture around here somewhere that show the line across the mantle bug as life. Weird! I'm sure RFM based it on a pic somewhere...I just don't remember that being a feature of the G mantlet. Huh. |
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armornutii
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Post by armornutii on Jun 13, 2023 18:43:33 GMT -5
It always bugs me when there's no plastic option for every part. Sometimes you don't want to have to mess with absolutely miniscule PE bits! The mold seam on the mantlet - it's so pronounced, it must HAVE to be there? I'm not near any of my Panther refs right now to check. Found thread with pic I was refering to. Should be close to top of first page and is titled "Panther Reference" OP was Chromedome. |
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Post by tcoat on Jun 13, 2023 19:31:55 GMT -5
It always bugs me when there's no plastic option for every part. Sometimes you don't want to have to mess with absolutely miniscule PE bits! The mold seam on the mantlet - it's so pronounced, it must HAVE to be there? I'm not near any of my Panther refs right now to check. Found thread with pic I was refering to. Should be close to top of first page and is titled "Panther Reference" OP was Chromedome. Yep. Hans didn't have the sand molds lined up very well on that one! Probably a very late production one where they were starting to give up on the niceties of grinding off excess and such.  |
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stikpusher
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Post by stikpusher on Jun 13, 2023 20:29:32 GMT -5
Too much beer and schnapps for the casting crew the night before… 🤨
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 13, 2023 20:47:42 GMT -5
Too much beer and schnapps for the casting crew the night before… 🤨 How can we blame them? They make the best beer in the world! Me drinking little too much beer in Munich back in 2016.  |
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 13, 2023 20:48:44 GMT -5
It always bugs me when there's no plastic option for every part. Sometimes you don't want to have to mess with absolutely miniscule PE bits! The mold seam on the mantlet - it's so pronounced, it must HAVE to be there? I'm not near any of my Panther refs right now to check. I know! Crazy, huh? Me and my OCD really want to remove it but I checked my book and it shows that final production had those.  I might tone it down later...  Very nice! That gun looks great! I feel ya with the PE. I get it all the time and it'll irritate me to no end and yet I keep getting it. Lol. That! I think I enjoy being tortured that way... maybe it's PE fetish thing? LOL It always bugs me when there's no plastic option for every part. Sometimes you don't want to have to mess with absolutely miniscule PE bits! The mold seam on the mantlet - it's so pronounced, it must HAVE to be there? I'm not near any of my Panther refs right now to check. Found thread with pic I was refering to. Should be close to top of first page and is titled "Panther Reference" OP was Chromedome. Thanks man!!! Found thread with pic I was refering to. Should be close to top of first page and is titled "Panther Reference" OP was Chromedome. Yep. Hans didn't have the sand molds lined up very well on that one! Probably a very late production one where they were starting to give up on the niceties of grinding off excess and such. It reminds how German helmets, equipments, uniforms were made during late war... sub-par quality and short cuts were done to rush the productions. |
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reserve
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Post by reserve on Jun 13, 2023 21:11:21 GMT -5
Getting the hell bombed out of them on a daily basis probably did not help either
As you say, over complex, but it sure looks good
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 13, 2023 21:14:49 GMT -5
Getting the hell bombed out of them on a daily basis probably did not help either As you say, over complex, but it sure looks good That's for sure!!! Thanks buddy |
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stikpusher
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Post by stikpusher on Jun 13, 2023 21:16:50 GMT -5
Too much beer and schnapps for the casting crew the night before… 🤨 How can we blame them? They make the best beer in the world! Me drinking little too much beer in Munich back in 2016.  I know what you mean… although you’re obviously still upright, so you haven’t had too much 😉 |
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 14, 2023 8:42:41 GMT -5
I know what you mean… although you’re obviously still upright, so you haven’t had too much 😉 LOL! I happen to have few pictures of myself being so happy after several glasses and I don't think you want to see them too! |
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Post by tcoat on Jun 14, 2023 8:58:03 GMT -5
I know what you mean… although you’re obviously still upright, so you haven’t had too much 😉 LOL! I happen to have few pictures of myself being so happy after several glasses and I don't think you want to see them too! How about two years of it from the age of 18 to 20! No that jean jacket no longer fits.  |
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Post by Tobi on Jun 14, 2023 13:51:44 GMT -5
I wondered the same but I really like the texture. It is possible that they rushed with the production during the late war period to get those out of factory sooner? You should have seen the German helmets especially the differences between M36 and M42 helmets which I have and you will be surprised to see how rough the texture is on late war M42 helmet. After priming and painting jobs, we probably won't see much especially the camo result. The texture of the rolled armour is not from the rolling process but from the surface hardening. Rolling the plates was done to align the grain (yes steel has a grain) to make the steel more resilient and spread the stress of impact this gave it some flex to absorb the energy but left it "soft". To counter that they surface hardened with high intensity open flame oxy-acetylene torching and an oil quench. This gave a hard outer surface to deflect or shatter rounds and a softer inside that would flex to absorb the energy. The texture on the outside is a result of the steel spalling and deforming on the surface from the torched heat treat. This is why you only see it on certain German armour since this method was only used for a short time. I might add, the later in the war and the worse the raw material situation became, the steel, especially used on the Panther, became prone to breaking and splitting, due to the hardening process. There are pictures from shot up Panthers, where you can see the impact hole and around like spider webs huge cracks and even missing splinters. |
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Post by 406 Silverado on Jun 14, 2023 20:31:23 GMT -5
Man this one's lookin' good inside that turret Andy. I was sold on RFM models the second I opened the VW staff car kit. Just PACKED with details even in that thing.
Looking forward to more on this one.
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Post by deafpanzer on Jun 14, 2023 22:43:23 GMT -5
LOL! We would have made great friends cause same thing happened pretty much when I was in college. I see that you live in London, Ontario. My American parents owned a lake house in Fort Erie, Ontario for more than 25 years but unfortunately they sold it last year so they can settle down in Florida all year now. I will miss visiting Ontario especially Niagara Falls and Niagara on the Lake. I might add, the later in the war and the worse the raw material situation became, the steel, especially used on the Panther, became prone to breaking and splitting, due to the hardening process. There are pictures from shot up Panthers, where you can see the impact hole and around like spider webs huge cracks and even missing splinters. That makes sense too! I am glad I am back here in the forum cause I am always learning something here. Thanks for sharing Tobi! Man this one's lookin' good inside that turret Andy. I was sold on RFM models the second I opened the VW staff car kit. Just PACKED with details even in that thing. Looking forward to more on this one. Thanks Joe! That's for sure! I will not hesitate to buy more RFM kits when I see them at future shows. I took a good look at my stash recently and I had no idea that I already have four RFM kits. LOL |
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Thanks for looking mate!
